Our company is

a small family owned brick and mortar store and we give bonuses each year at Christmas. If at all possible we give one around the end of May/early June as well. If we must cut out one bonus, it is the one in May. The one for Christmas is given early enough in the month that our employees can use it for Christmas if they need to.
What is funny is that we have someone of a certain ‘faith’ that does not celebrate Christmas (non-Jew) but she accepts the Christmas bonus anyway. Won’t come to the Christmas party (paid for by our company) or take part in any gift exchanges though.

Okay it doesn’t exactly fit the tune, but that’s what I’ve been wanting to do for months.

I even mentioned it once before on the list. Well I must have been a very good girl somewhere along the line because yesterday ds called and said “Has Dad called you yet?”

I cringed heavily when he said that because that is exactly what he said back in February of 2009 (just after we had got back from the last trip to Las Vegas for AU). But his voice was different this time, so I timidly said “noooo, why?”

He replied he should let Dad call me but he was so excited he had to tell someone. The company owner had been in the office earlier in the day and had handed out Christmas cards to everyone one at a time stopping a their desks to visit with them. He wished each one Merry Christmas and said “this is to thank you for giving us such a good year”.
Each card contained a check for $2,000 (less taxes of course)!!!!!! Ds was just beside himself. He’s never had a Christmas bonus before (and he just turned 38) and he’s only been with the company 4 months. He was still pinging when he went to bed last night.
Dh never did call me, just came home and gave me the check! It is enough to replenish the emergency fund (report on the usage of it coming up in the blog later this month) AND to pay off two of our smallest bills!!!! When I told dh what I wanted to do with the money he said it would be the best Christmas gift he could think of for all of us. YES!!!! We put the check in the bank last night and Monday I’ll go personally to pay off Social Security (so I can get a receipt as PROOF we’ve paid them off) and then I’ll pay off Lowe’s!!!

Isalmic Banking in Pak is really a myth

At pakistan’s leading Islamic bank, management have objection own bearded people wearing loose fit (shalwar kameez), keeping trousers above knee. Women are dressing the way no one can claim shariah.

At annual gathering of the same bank, a senior management employee was lamenting at conventional banking with furor. Though he is at this bank after retiring from top pakistani commercial bank of Mansha Group enjoying lucrative job.

Go through the deposit & loan rates of these banks, they will charge you extra on loans & pay lesser on your deposits. Get a home loan & one will come to know that they will have to pay twice than conventional (check website for personal loans particularly).

When the stock market crashed in 2008. One of the islamic bank’s investment company’s (also maintaining stock index) representative claimed superior performance of islamic investment (like Musharaf’s moderate islam ideology)to offering higher returns with low risk after stock turned back on track in 2009. Though everybody knows how stocks are maneuvered here.

I can not get it why their calculations use conventional systems’ statistics.

Emotional problems are often the hardest to deal with

and I pray for strength and love for you and help for him. I grew up with a bipolar mother and I understand how scary that can be. We never knew what would trigger her melt downs. This is why I spent most of my young childhood being moved from aunt to aunt. But with the right help I am sure he will come out the other side so much better off for being in your loving household. Mom finally got the proper help later in life and the difference was so wonderful.
I’m glad things are slowly getting into a routine for all three of the newest children and you. Handling all of this along with bronchitis has had to have been hard. I know when I’ve had bronchitis in the past the worst part was at the end when I usually develop a dry non-productive cough that just racks my whole body. I use to take so many cough syrups and such to deal with it, but nothing seemed to work. UNTIL I stumbled across an old recipe for a thyme tea for just that type of cough. I now use it every time I even get a hint of bronchitis and it works every time. Because of the honey in it I would not recommend giving it to the younger children. But at least you could try it—I don’t think it would pass through to the baby if you are breast feeding—check with your doctor about you using honey.

like we’ve never seen…

My 2nd oldest son turned 8 in November and he had an emotional breakdown (mental breakdown maybe?).including hurting our other children (right down to the 2 yr old). He’s a wee bit better right now but we’re trying to get him into a Trauma Assessment Center to get him properly diagnoses (PTSD? Anxiety? Bipolar?) He still has breakdowns and negative behaviors but it isn’t quite as intense.
Outside of that we’re doing pretty good…We are helping our new little ones settle down, understand love and family and permanency and its a long journey. Our baby is doing well and a sweet little guy!

We’ve been fighting bronchitis for 2 months now (6 weeks for me) but I think I’m on the upswing with my 3rd or 4th antibiotic. I read on here but don’t check in often…I do try to keep my blog updated.

I don’t think you get it

Some people may be willing to talk about sales figures and debate whether or not any given MLM is doing well or not.
I really don’t care

This forum was NEVER about that. This forum is about the emotional toll MLM’s take on the loved ones that have to live with someone being brainwashed by an MLM.

Stop doing this. Stop trying to prove IN THIS SPACE that whatever MLM you’re talking about is the one that’s making money. Just stop. There are plenty of places online you can take your message. That you choose to do it here makes you very suspect to me.

Would you go to an Alcoholic’s Anonymous meeting with liquor and blow and try to convince the people there that hey, drinking and snorting coke is fine if you can handle it?

Would you go to a support forum for abused wives and tell them “Hey, maybe if you had listened to your husband you wouldn’t have gotten smacked around so much?”

Because that’s what you’re doing. You’re not telling people how to make money or that “maybe it’s not that bad after all.” You’re telling people that addiction and abuse are acceptable.

Stop it. Just stop. Because I, for one, will not stop posting until you do.

I will fight the message that any MLM is ok until someone meets the tax return challenge. I will post here every day, every hour if that’s what it takes.

But I will not let the false message that Amway is growing go unchallenged in this space because this forum means too much to me.

So what? Amway managed to hook in a few more people than they usually do and call that growth. Are those people making money or is Amway making money off those people?

So no, I will not admit any such thing about Polly and “market saturation” or “increasing revenue” or sales anywhere on the planet. You sound like yet another presentation and believe me, I’ve heard them all.

You are reading way too much into what I have written

This is the same thing that happened when I tried to participate in this forum a few years ago. Even if you are 99% against MLMs you get attacked for the 1%.

I am not in MLM either. I gave it up about 6 years ago when I realized I had made a stupid decision by getting involved in a business I did no research on, marketing a product I knew very little about. Now I am semi-retired and living off residuals from the three franchises I own.

If this forum is all about making up fake crap just to make everybody feel better, then I agree I am in the wrong place. All I am saying is that there are a lot of things wrong with MLM, but being “doomed to fail” because of market saturation simply isn’t one of them.

That’s all.

Posted in MLM


No matter how long I’m away from this forum there are still people who come here and try to convince others that whatever TT they are involved in and what few they’ve heard of are “not that bad”.

What you need to understand is that I am sitting in a room, alone and will probably be single for the rest of my natural life because of an TT.

I’m too old, too tired, too jaded to start over. My husband destroyed our marriage over Primerica. Years before that he was in Amway and a part of selling long distance and a few other things I never knew about until long after I met him.

Just stop already. Stop trying to promote Amway or any other TT. If there are still moderators here, STOP people from doing this. And if you need more moderators, I will gladly volunteer.

Because this forum saved my sanity. And I truly hate to see anyone marketing TT’s here in this space unchallenged.

Posted in TT

Several reasons

An actual pyramid that depends on selling to others does have a problem with saturation. There’s even a Dragnet episode about this.

The catch is that Amway *IS* a pyramid scheme, but functions differently. The king pins don’t depend on the sales of products to bring in money. They just need to sell the business tools and get them to come to conventions and they’ll make money.

I don’t know what they use now, but in ’07 or so, they were selling CDs that cost about 50 cents to make, but they were selling them for about $10 or more. And I did the math on conventions. In short, for a smaller one of 5,000 – 8,000, we’ll assume there’s 6,000 people attending. I checked on venues that could host up to 11,000 people. Rental for the weekend (this was around ’07) would be about $25,000 for the weekend. Someone else here checked on insurance: $5,000. Advertising? They do it through CommuniKate or whatever voice mail system they have. It’s not only free, it’s paid for by IBOs. Minions to do all the work for them? People think it’s an honor if they get to help the pins – they almost fight for the honor of doing the manual labor. So that’s free. Hucksters selling items? They pay for tables, so that’s more income. And the IBOs? They pay $100 per person and say, “They’re not making much money. Rental is expensive. So 6,000 show up. It never occurs to one of the drone IBOs, but 6,000 people paying $100 each is $600,000 – which is more than half a million dollars. And the cost is under $50,000!

So if 6,000 people show up, they get $600,000 income minus less than $50,000 in expenses. That’s still over HALF A MILLION in profit!

While it doesn’t go to those hosting the event, it goes to their speakers, which are uplines in other Amway groups. So they’re making big bucks for those speeches. And when other uplines are hosting conventions, the people running this one will be the speakers.

As long as there are those who are gullible enough to be convinced they HAVE to go to these things and have to buy the tools, the uplines will continue to make money.

And there’s new suckers coming along every day. We know at P. T. Barnum said about suckers…

So it doesn’t collapse because the *sell* people on a pyramid scheme where products are sold, but the actuality is it’s a different kind of pyramid.

Posted in IBO

How come amway is still growing?

Hello everyone! I have a question to ask. One of the reasons why TTs are doomed-to-fail is because of market saturation. The retort that always get shot back at me is that Amway has been around for 50 years, does it look like it’s getting saturated?
I was just wondering, how come Amway is still growing, even after 50 years???